The Diesel Is Dying

Discussion in 'Automotive' started by FS16, Aug 15, 2017.

  1. FS16

    FS16
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    If you've been watching the automotive industry over here in europe, you should know that there's been a massive diesel hype/boom over the last 20 years. It has reached a point where ~75% of all sold cars in Austria/Germany were diesels, and many models were available just with diesel engines. Wanna get a 2012 VW Sharan with a petrol engine? Sorry, thats just impossible. But over the last year or so, starting with the VW diesel scandal (or whatever you wanna call it), diesels have become less and less popular. The scandal has led to many investigations, at last proving that diesels only have less CO2 emissions than petrol engines because they use less fuel, and actually with a same use emitting 15% more. And looking at all other emissions, diesels are much worse than petrol engines. This has led to many big european cities partly banning diesels because of their micro dust, etc emissions. So, beacuse all of those events, diesel cars have been massively losing worth, and buying diesel new or used now is the most stupid thing to do, and everybody is trying to sell their diesels asap.

    So, you might think, thats a downfall, but diesels will recover. But that actually might not be true. Because when that whole diesel boom started, they had many big advantages over petrol engines (lower fuel use, more torque at lower rpm, etc), but with petrol engines evolving, those advantages almost dont exist anymore. And even if the worth eventually stops dropping, everybody will have already bought petrol cars, and people in cities will have electric cars because of the probably soon complete diesel ban in big cities.

    So, I think the diesel's death in europe has started and there soon wont be any more diesels. What do you think?


    note: this is an austrian's perspective, correct me if this doesnt apply to other parts of europe
     
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  2. Youngtimer

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    Well in in my country interest for diesels is still big. Many people drive diesel cars because they think they're reliable, consumpt very little fuel and price of diesel was lower than petrol price for years. However, in couple last years, state rised the price of diesel, but people are still interesting for them.
     
    #2 Youngtimer, Aug 15, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2017
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  3. Ezo

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    In my country diesel is only legal for trucks/buses, so toyota ford and some others advertise their diesel pickups as work trucks, but not many people use them this way
    --- Post updated ---
    I dont think diesel has more emissions than gas /s
     
  4. Youngtimer

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    I heard that diesel cause some sort of cancer so it's far more dangerous.
     
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  5. Ezo

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    I know, it was sarcasm, diesel trucks (at least here in brazil) stink a lot, and theyre certainly not healthier to the human body, its like cigarette but with enormous cylinders
     
  6. FS16

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    Haha, i know. But here in Austria ive met countless people bragging about how environment-friendly their new diesels are, and for years there has never been any 100% true answer. Im glad its finally off the table
     
  7. CarBro74

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    Well in America, we never really had popular diesel cars. Just diesel trucks. But diesel trains in the good ol' US of A is really where diesel shines. It is cheap to make here, can be made with lots of horsepower, and is fuel efficent. But I am not really an expert of Europe (because I don't live there) and the fact that Trump is pulling from the Paris Agreement, save the world type stuff, if diesel trucks are killed by biofuel, a lot of diesel trains would still be here. The US has more freight trains than Europe and that is where diesel shines so in the train world and America at least it isn't dying. As for Europe, we just need to wait.
    --- Post updated ---
    Lol, I know how this is car sub-forum and I basically gave a lecture about trains I'm a stupid nerd.
     
    #7 CarBro74, Aug 16, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2017
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  8. Copunit12

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    Diesel vs petrol-gasoline (I'm a stupid american so I'll just use gasoline instead). Diesel has many problems over gasoline but it also is better than gasoline. Diesel is much more difficult to use in the winter but so will electrical cars. Diesel from what I hear is a bit better in fuel consumption but Diesel dose have the torque advantage over gasoline.
    I doubt that Semi trucks will be replaced soon with electrical engines and pickups will probably become hybrid diesel's. Also a lot of European country's forgot that some Diesels can take vegetable oil instead. (I don't know what happens to the engine).
     
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  9. Ezo

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    What it does to the engine idk too, but I know diesel will not die in Brasil, at least for now because now they started selling bio diesel, that is made with bio things( I don't remember from what exactly) but they say it's better, but I think that running a engine in corn won't make any goods to a engine :p , maybe for the environment ain't too, but I can be wrong too
     
  10. VeyronEB

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    I think its pretty much the perfect time to buy a diesel while the price is down, assuming you aren't in one of the cities that banned them all of a sudden.

    I don't think even 1 in 10000 average people know much about the VW diesel scandal at all and even less actually care so as long as there isn't any obvious ban incoming in your area or a much wider ban (which won't happen as it wouldn't really be practical to do) then there is no reason not to own one.
     
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  11. CarBro74

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    *cough cough* Stuttgart (even though they banned older diesels but still) *cough cough*
     
  12. eeEtilt

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    We drive a diesel. Not only is the petrol Duster a no-go, the diesel one packs more torque and is available in Laureate trim. Although the VW scandal was covered a lot by the news, diesels are still quite popular.

    Besides, the Duster has fit into the roughly Duster-shaped hole in our commute and my mum loves the thing.
     
  13. SixSixSevenSeven

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    While I agree with the notion that the diesel is dying, the amount of misinformation here is frankly, hilarious.

    Kids if you don't know what you're on about, say nothing
     
  14. brianvalk

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    well here in the Netherlands diesel isn't very populair for regular cars, so second hand diesels are very cheap even from like 2011 are under 5000 euro and the reason for that is because here you pay 2 times the amount of road taxes for diesel, an uncle of mine has a fiat bravo with a 1,4 l diesel and it weighs about 1200 kg but he still has to pay 1365 euro's a year on road taxes just because its a diesel, the government in the Netherlands are what we call here "legal thiefs" this among a couple of reasons is why car culture isn't very big here in the Netherlands wich is a sad thruth :confused::(:(
     
  15. CHEESE!

    CHEESE!
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    They also emit much more carbon monoxide which is more dangerous than CO2.
     
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  16. FS16

    FS16
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    As I said, correct me when Im wrong. What exactly was I wrong about? Im happy to learn...
    --- Post updated ---
    Buying would be good a bit later, because right now the price still falling (a least in austria)
    While that might be true, I think people at least would do some research looking at reselling, and if they find out their car loses all of its worth in just a few months, they'd buy a petrol car. Also, diesel sales have gone down significantly, so at least some people care.
     
  17. Cheekqo

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    Diesel soot doesn't rise up to the atmosphere so it doesn't affect the atmosphere, but it does affect the human lungs, while petrol doesn't affect humans (I think) but it does affect the atmosphere.
    I think diesels are better as what person sticks their head up the exhaust pipe of a vehicle,
    I am very familiar with diesel vehicles as lots of them where I live are diesels, and the government has changed their mind about it.
     
  18. Michaelflat

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    In the quest to improve emissions and fuel economy you can't really do this unless you want to risk your engine and fuel injection system, it is really high tech on the common rail systems, with many hundreds of Psi being maintained by a fuel pump, if this goes kaput then it's going to be costly to fix, and if one of the Piezo-Electric injectors go wrong then you loose a cylinder and a lot of money as they are very expensive to replace :eek:
     
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  19. FLyInG 2 YoUr SoUL

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    Here in Italy diesel is still a thing. VW emission scandal is more or less an argument for VW haters.

    NCG and LPG have been growing in popularity and they might soon replace diesel thanks to the competitive price of fuel and the numerous advantages offered by what is being promoted as "affordable green transportation".
     
  20. IvanGF14

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    Let me explain this a bit. The main problem with the diesel engines is that they produce nitrogen dioxide. Why this happens? Because the temps the cilinder reachs during the compression and explosion strokes are really high, so this appears. In theory, the petrol engine polutes more than a diesel engine, but, with the antipollution systems, is easier to remove the worst things in a petrol engine, so at the end, the diesel pollutes more. Now the problem is, "thanks" to the fuel efficiency and consuption things, nowadays most of petrol engines are also producing the nitrogen dioxide, because the compression ratios and the pressure inside the cilinder are getting higher and higher, to get more power from less displacement, so its appearing the same situation on petrol too. But, still, its easier to clean the gases from a petrol engine, so thats why diesel "is dying" (here in Spain most of the brands offer different diesel alternatives)
     
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