Stop trying to make yourself the victim, because there is no victim. Nobody told you to "feel bad for existing," you are sitting in this thread doing nothing but being an asshole. First off, we get the actual career overhaul, which itself takes so much time and effort to produce, none of which YOU put in. So what they decide to TEMPORARILY make an Italy addon paid? It's coming out to the public soon, and even if that wasn't the case, after all the work they have put into this, you have no right to complain about it being paid, ESPECIALLY when we are given the actual career overhaul itself for free. The RLS team is using money from their patreon gold members, people who bought Italy, to give YOU paid wheel packs FOR FREE. Nobody is sitting here begging for money, that's the narrative that's in your head and your head alone, you have been nothing but disrespectful for absolutely no reason.
I think both sides have valid points, and I think staying weary of paywalls and paid mods' actions is everyone's duty. Raceless may not be getting worse, but trust me, the moment people stop being weary and critical of paywalls, it's the moment the modding community as a whole will start falling down the path of greed. People who look for and call out shady or crappy behavior and monetization are the first line of defence against those popping up in the first place, so let's be a little patient with folks who jump the gun, even if they're mistaken. I'd take someone like doDeca, who mistakenly complained about something then retracted their mistake, over someone like you who's only licking boots and being nasty. Me, personally, I think paid beta testing is a super good business model, miles better than paywalling mods entirely (especially for wheels, seriously? Wheels?) and I myself would be supporting this beta if I'd ever played the previous version. (I haven't, therefore i don't know if it's worth it, and I'll wait for a full stable release before trying it out, but if you enjoy it a lot you bet your ass i'll be paying up to playtest the next one.)
I don't mean to be nasty, typically, I was just pissed off with how this guy has been acting throughout the thread and I felt like somebody needed to say something about it, but I agree with you that paywalled mods kinda suck. What pissed me off is how they were trying to spin the narrative to make it seem like the RLS team is trying to use this mod for nothing but making money, complaining about stuff that is literally coming for free, complaining about the release when we haven't even hit the deadline (like delays don't also exist..), and trying to make it seem like people are "bullying them" or something (for lack of a better term). I understand that he said he made a mistake, but if you continue to read the thread the disrespect continues. It's not right, at all, it's incredibly disrespectful to the RLS team and some of the other people that they replied to, and I can admit that I got disrespectful, but frankly, if someone fails to respect the people around them, especially those doing something for them, they aren't deserving of respect.
Wow looks like there has been a lot of back and forth while we have been working on the update. I came here to share some hopefully good news, so let's start with that. The wait is almost over! Public release for the RLS Career Overhaul 0.35 compatibility patch will be Friday 4/18, 10am EST! Regarding the back and forth, I don't really want to jump into the debate but maybe I can clear some confusion and clear up some assumptions. 1) Tristan and I made the jump to full time 4 months ago. Same day we opened a Patreon with hopes that we could receive enough support to stay full time on the project, else we would need to abandon the project. RLS Career Overhaul would have ended as soon as 0.35 update came out as both of our jobs at the time were demanding more of our free time. Long story short if that didn't make sense, Tristan and I needed to choose the mod or our jobs. 2) I don't like paid mods either. But... I understand that people deserve to choose to try to get paid for their work. Creators have the right to choose their various business models; we chose the early access beta method. If enough people were willing to bug test early versions with the risk of major bugs, then that could allow the more polished version to be free for everyone else, and Tristan and I still be able to feed our families. On that note, thank you to all the Patreon members for your testing lately. The 0.35 update was an extremely tough to work through. We created code for existing features that tied into the vanilla career mode code. The nature of modding an early access game, specifically modding a game mode that is in active development (meaning they are creating new code and rewriting existing foundation code) means it is... challenging to reimplement things. It's sort of like if you were building a house, but every quarter the foundation is going to be adjusted, re-poured, some parts curing, some parts totally removed. It's going to take some time, and we never really know how long it will take. 3) Regarding TheTalkingBath's paid wheel mods, we made a deal that helped us both as well as the community. I really wanted a high-quality wheel pack in the career collection, he deserved much more attention to his Patreon as he has some amazing paid mods, and clearly the community is passionate about free stuff. Without disclosing details of the deal, it would be wrong to just ask if I could take his paid mod and release a version for free. So, because of the amazing support we've received, I paid to allow a couple of his mods to come free. And to give back to those high paying members, they have first access to it until May. We try to be transparent about release schedules to combat the FOMO, so that if you choose to purchase a Patreon membership, you are as well informed as possible. The double edge sword of that is there will be disappointment when there are delays. If I have to choose one, I will choose to disappoint free users over those who have donated their own hard-earned money every time. Hopefully this makes some sense and clears things up. Thank you again for all the support you all have given, can't wait to get back to creating new features!
Thank you RLS for the update, we all look forward to it and appreciate the team's hard work! Knowing you switched to full time on this, I think we all as a community can understand the early access better and appreciate the transparency! Loved watching the stream last night!
The RLS Team (of which i am part) have literally been pulling 16 hour days for WEEKS to get everything out. Only last night we got the Pre-Release Beta (which is legit the only playable 0.35 RLS experience) pushed out to the beta community. Raceless has struck a deal with TTB for the paid wheel packs BY PAYING ON EVERYONES BEHALF. It has entered into the beta AS ALL FEATURES do and will come out FOR FREE with the public release of the RLS Collection V3. Its disheartening to see some people with no idea of what's actually going on making such massive claims for absolutely no reason other than to be a hater. Enjoy all the work we do for free or pay to get into the beta... either way enjoy the content, but please maybe just think before blasting a whole team of volunteers based on wrong opinions. P.S, Everything the RLS team has EVER done has been come out to the public for free. Nothing is "locked" behind a paywall, its tested by a band of donators who value the early access despite the bugs etc.
It looks like some of my offhand comments may be being misconstrued, so I'll just finish with this: - All humans are automatically deserving of a base level of respect: be allowed to exist without being criticized for existing. - BUSINESSES are not automatically deserving of said respect, customer feedback is an implied part of receiving money in exchange for goods or services. If you are having a conversation with me as a human, I will be nice. If you are trying to use that conversation as a stealth way to use empathy as a marketing tactic, I will not be nice. I have NO disagreements with any of RLS's actions, in fact after this interaction I subscribed to their Patreon for a month. It's just important to remember that businesses aren't people, and people aren't businesses. --- EDIT: For balance, I will say that subscribing to the Patreon doesn't actually buy access to the beta as advertised. It buys supposed access to a private channel on a Discord server that has its own rules and policies that are not made clear before payment. Despite money having been taken out of my bank account, I now do not have the thing that was promised in exchange for that money. As a human, I completely understand why RLS has done it this way (to prevent leaks, I assume). As a paying customer, that's literal criminal activity. I'm not saying I'm particularly angry, as this is how TTB's mods operate as well, but it just puts a nice cherry on top of my point. People good, greed bad.
Sorry you were unaware that in order to have access to the downloads, you would have to join the discord. The reason for the discord requirement is to provide necessary support and feedback during the betas. I would have preferred you reach out privately before accusing me of literal criminal activity, perhaps we could have discussed motives for the decisions our team has made instead of assuming. Regardless I have refunded your membership since you were unable to access anything. Patreon says it will take 5 - 7 business days. If you have problems I would direct you to them.
Thank you for the response! I look forward to the public release, and I will be re-donating regardless. I want to support you in your endeavors, I just didn't ever receive the discord invite and wanted to specify that the advertised Patreon perks are not actually what a supporter receives.
lol, dude, get help. I dont know where your hate is coming from but its not healthy. We have 4600 members in our discord loving the work we do, 500+ patreon members and 1 person complaining.... you. If you link the patreon to your discord you'll have full access to everything you pay for as well as the support of a huge community and FAQ aswell as multiple opportunities to raise suggestions and requests to the staff to help shape the future of RLS. It seems to me you're desperately trying to justify some sort of stance against us founded on absolutely nothing.
Yeah, it does. If you accept payment in exchange for goods or services, you are operating a business, whether you want to admit it or not. Let me break down for you how this works: - Contributors write code - RLS also writes code - RLS gets all the money, even from the contributors who helped them write code I'm trying to help you all. This is how people get scammed, even if intentions are good. --- Post updated --- 500+ paying customers sure sounds like an enterprise to me.
With a business, the point is to make money, accepting donations is not a business. This is the last I'm replying to this insanity-driven conversation, so can we all please just shut up and go enjoy what we've all been missing instead of fighting over stupid shit? If doDeca wants to keep going, just ignore em and bam, more time to enjoy RLS
Accepting 'donations' in exchange for access to a product is a business. Accepting 'donations' in exchange for the privilege to work with you is borderline predatory. "16 hour days..." "the work we do for free..." "we pay to get into the beta..." Look, I'm not going to keep saying the same thing over and over again. If you are OK with this kind of thing happening in the BeamNG community, then I guess I can't stop you. But I've done my best to lay out what's wrong, and if I've failed, that's on me.
Yes, we are using the mod to make money fine. But we are only doing to so we can afford to live and make this mod as great as we can. This benefits everyone not only the paid members. Yep updates take longer but that is because we have higher standards Who are these contributors and provide proof. Please elaborate, I don't think you understand how this all works when the game is in a stable state we will release it to the public. FYI you had 0 impact on the timing of any of this so please refrain from taking any credit. What do you "have" to pay for? What happened after this? Seems like you are the one being impatient I'm sorry we tricked you into downloading a free mod. I'm sorry but we will never make you pay us again or able to pay us. If you are going to hate on what we do then you will only ever get free access and no You obviously will, seems like you enjoy fighting this invisible battle I do not believe this after everything you have said about us. I am honestly confused what your problem has been, If you don't like the mod don't use it. This is a free mod and if people decide to support development then they get access to the beta and per-release through our discord. This is something you seem to hate about us which is why as I said earlier we won't ever want your contributions, so this means you wont ever "have" to or be able to pay us. For everyone else in this community we greatly appreciate all of the support you all have given us, This has been an amazing opportunity to work on this mod! I can't wait to get back into making features for the career rather than making it compatible. We have some cool ideas that we will be implementing here soon!
