WIP Beta released A new *CITY* map - LOS INJURUS 2021-06-21

The large city of Los Injurus welcomes you with an update!

  1. Slugfest

    Slugfest
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    Oh, I see, no problem
    --- Post updated ---
    I've replied in General Discussion here: https://www.beamng.com/threads/general-discussion.7384/page-2221#post-1427726
    Please do remember that we're not supposed to talk political opinions on the forums, so I am limited to what I say.
     
  2. dumpling

    dumpling
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    Oh I am extremely sorry I was just not really getting what is happening only with the Los Injurus thread, and nothing else. I will never talk about anything relating to politics or anything outside of BeamNG.drive. Sorry again for the confusion.
     
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  3. Agent_Y

    Agent_Y
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    What is happeing on this thread is completely normal, it's always like this, people talking mostly on the topic of the map but getting often sidetracked, and also frequent progress reports.
     
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  4. Driver_1

    Driver_1
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    I think a racetrack would be a cool addition to this map. I was thinking maybe an oval superspeedway (possibly abandoned?).
     
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  5. jackmo2207

    jackmo2207
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    Is there a version of the map here that's been updated since June? I haven't found any files, and Bob was talking about updates coming in a couple weeks, way back in November.
    --- Post updated ---
    Oh, is it on patreon?
     
  6. silvermanblu

    silvermanblu
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    Bob hasn't updated the Patreon since december. He has been busy on models and optimizing
     
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  7. Sir. Vapenation

    Sir. Vapenation
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  8. Cheddar Charles

    Cheddar Charles
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    I work in a very ordinary shaped brick building, with plenty of variation in colors. I'll snap some high quality pictures for you next week. Some high rise apartments across the street too, lots of tree obstructions tho.
     
  9. bob.blunderton

    bob.blunderton
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    On this website, many resources have discussion threads (which usually and often pre-date the official resource) that allow people whom are interested in said resource (a map, a vehicle, prop, script, etc) to follow it's development. Many authors do this to not only keep motivated (hey it does help!), but to get user input and help the folks who want to use the resource end up with something they will love most.
    Here, both map supporters (thank-you btw) and those who can't monetarily support the map can have a say on what goes into the map, how much of said 'thing' goes into the map (say if it should have more highways, or if it needs more downtown area, or even more race-tracks) and so-forth and so-on.
    Basically, everyone can have a say in the map, and I look forward to hearing from folks. Also, while supporters have a majority say as they rightfully should, that doesn't mean I ignore everyone else either.

    Bottom line / TL:DR, This is a city map (more like a whole county or parish), made by players for players, with only what players want in this map and hopefully not a lot of what we don't want.
    While it can be pretty quick to slap a boring, repetitive city together, it'll look awful, not be very fun, and it will run terribly and have a rather nasty render-engine bottleneck. Keeping FPS up takes the longest - most of which is done in the modeling end of things.
    I purchase models, textures, sounds/bgm with project funds after the software costs (some are monthly, some larger payments one-off or yearly as needed) are covered. These models often are usually fairly cheap or gotten on 'make offer' prices where & when I can afford them. These models often aren't optimized much at all (as the ones that are, are variably optimized many worse than others, and almost never to my personal model-creation standards). These models take days or even a week or more to optimize (depending on size, small buildings could take two days, super-fancy huge stuff or focal-point areas can take TWO WEEKS), and then more time to prep a map area to put it into the map. It's very very rare that project money goes into computer hardware, that's usually something I purchase myself - only when it blows up unexpectedly I might use some funds (if needed) to cover immediate hardware replacement, again if-needed / when-needed - or if upgrades are essential to continue. I have spent over the 3.5 years on THE CITY PORTION of this project, and over several THOUSAND dollars on software, assets, and almost that much on computer hardware (and my machine isn't cutting edge, many people here likely have better/faster/more fps!). I don't frequently update this machine often either, about once every 4~5 years unless something went seriously wrong - but that's what insurance is for. That said, I am currently running head-long into the limits of 8gb of VRAM and what 32gb of system RAM allows me to do - so it sometimes takes a little longer to make things than it should - but I still get done what I need to do. I am not currently going to even think of upgrading the GPU right now (try next year, but prices are coming down), but might eventually get more RAM for this in the summer.

    A storm is coming, we're in for one last blast of winter here - after two weeks of 60F weather (for the most part). It's going to go from 60~64F today, to below freezing tonight, to 6+ inches of snow by 1pm tomorrow - 1300 hours), NOT FUN. So I best just throw some model preview pics of the stuff I picked up yesterday for the map. I only purchase when there's a sale or on make-offer deals to get the most bang for the buck. If I could cut a penny in half, I would.
    Hopefully my interwebs cooperates.
    There's also been a 8-store strip mall, a Long-Dong Silver's, and a Shoe-in's (or is it Shananagins?) added to the map, along with another mile or so of road all with curbing. Plus there's about 11 more home lots added in with all but two mostly done. I don't have pictures yet until I get some more building models in with working textures. This is in the area between the 11-foot-8 spawn point current location and the abandoned mall. I am trying to do a large chunk of this area so that there's a lot more content. The way I am going at this, I can't just do half of it as it's really torn up right now, and it must be done right the first time, or it's all double-work if I have to rip it all out and do it over.

    Models pictured below are obviously not in-game yet, but this is the next stuff to get put into the map.
    Some buildings will look radically different. Non-american styled buildings will be 'Americanized' and otherwise made to look proper in a USA city scene, otherwise that would break immersion. Some buildings may come through with more detail added, some may have less, and so-forth, and some furthermore will be re-skinned in a few different looks as-needed to get the most out of each model without making the scenery repeat so much.
    Keep in mind I must keep models interesting-looking while not making it too detailed as - while not as much as an FPS issue - it's also a model SIZE issue - as those have to occupy VRAM just like the textures do too.
    Textures may be lower quality in the later public versions of the map if video card prices do not come down enough (they will eventually), in-order to fit everything in the map (on medium texture detail) into an 8gb VRAM pool. There will be a texture upgrade available when this happens (and is partly what's been going on in the background, too) which will come for supporters first. This is due to the game not being able to stream out assets (as most any other game engines can do), it can only stream them in currently. Please ask your local support staff for full model streaming support!
    The 8GB VRAM limit is likely the single most limiting thing on building and scene complexity currently. That being said, I can slap down roads to my hearts content for the next 10 years and likely not exceed the VRAM pool any more than I already do. It's just scene diversity that takes the hit. Thankfully, I have already planned for this and it won't squash this project's vision or ability to see through to completion at all, it just has a few more hoops to jump through and somewhat longer dev-time.
    So enjoy the model previews. Sorry they're small preview pics, I only have 1366 x 760p (?) screens here at the moment - but at-least there's a few of them so I can model things efficiently.
    Friends don't let friends model on a single screen.

    Model previews are not all-inclusive but a sample of all the models purchased. Not all models are shown, basically. These ARE NOT in-game screen-shots, just to be clear, but are shots of the in-coming work-flow.
     

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  10. dumpling

    dumpling
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    Thank you for the detailed explanation. Looking forward to those buildings implemented into the map. :)
     
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  11. eggward

    eggward
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    i hope you implement that Transamerica Plaza building into the map. love that building
     
  12. bob.blunderton

    bob.blunderton
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    I sometimes go off on a tangent, rant, or other thing - so who am I to hate or admonish others for doing so? So here's another go-off-on-a-tangent...
    A late friend of the family who died at 84 last September said I "could have an enthralling, exciting discussion with a fence post / telephone pole anywhere I go". I couldn't help but laugh, because while a slight exaggeration it isn't too far from the honest truth. My response was "Hey! Fence posts / Telephone poles are people too!!!" I am a social bug and by default quite happy even just to be waking up still breathing - so once I get going, hope your comfy as it could be a while! If I wake up breathing, still in the bed, and am actually able to get out of it in short order, that's to me a very good day. Life has many simple pleasures like good conversation. Don't ever take it for granted though, even if you're just talking about the birds/bees/weather with a neighbor on the lawn. Tomorrow is never promised for anyone, after-all.
    Even if there's a whole page that's off topic, I am not the king. I am not even a simple peasant, it's not my ship (this site) and it's not me sinking it. I'm just along for the ride like everyone else and occasionally showing off map progress. While getting off-topic might be disruptive to most progress threads, it'll surely go back to being on-topic as the need arises. We're human and having healthy communication is just one of the things that got us so far as a species, and is a sign of good mental health. So while others may choose to see the glass half empty, or completely empty, I was raised to prefer to look at things on the positive note. Sorry if this "I" this and I that sounds self-absorbed, that is just my stance on things.
    So worry not about off-topic, it doesn't bother me; there's way worse things in life than that. That being the case, and on a somewhat related note, the site-wide rules about politics and other supposed-to-be no-see-um's still do apply. I am not signed up to be the policeman here though, so unless people are bashing other users or being a total wanker (can I even use that word?), I don't usually have anything to say on the matter.


    Noted! I will make sure this is considered wholly at some point in the city building process after I do a little research on it to see if/where I can fit it in.
    The update kept getting pushed back due to game-engine texture format changes, level-format changes (mainly texture indices), and me working on a TON of models simultaneously. There's other things like real-life getting in the way also, that aren't helping, including physical health issues. Progress still continues, however, and I appreciate everyone's patience on the matter as I work to deliver a product that will hopefully meet most/all expectations. When I decided to do the 11-foot-8 (and +8) bridge(s), that pushed it back a chunk because I need to create a larger area with that in mind or it'll look woefully incomplete. If I could just buy perfectly constructed models that would be great - but while I can get affordable models by throwing some money at the problem, finding good UV's is almost impossible. No one wants a repeat of Harriman (default spawn) FPS issues from Roane County where it could go down almost to 20 FPS even on a decent machine. That and I wished I had kept a little better record of some free resources I found around the web, so I didn't have to play catch-up on the legal end of things with use/re-use permissions.
    Building things in the map, that's quite fun! Creating buildings by comparison in a modeling program - or fixing the UV's of the purchased one - can take 100x longer to build something of equal size to what I could build in the editor, in roughly the same amount of time. I was going to cut corners on model UV preparation, but when I did an FPS / rendering engine performance test I was not a happy guy. So it must be done the right way and that takes a lot longer.
    Currently I am working on prepping both abandoned buildings and modern skyscrapers, and of-course tons of texture-work for the map too. Each section of the city / county is a little different theme-wise, so using the same already-made stuff across the entire map over and over isn't going to suffice.
    I have currently many blocks worth of roadway done that have beautiful cross-slope (the car-launching kind!) as they are by the abandoned mall, so we have more of that to look forward to also. I quite enjoy those so eventually they will be the majority around the city - some more sloped than others (example: Roads on a decent grade - going up or down a hill / mountain - won't need nearly as much cross-slope to effectively drain water off as do roads in flatter sections of the map) and larger/wider roads have more slope than narrow ones. Don't forget these design decisions or you could get some unexpected air-time and end up hitting the 2nd or 3rd floor of some buildings nearby. Sadly I can still count on one hand the amount of AA / AAA PC driving games that actually simulate cross-slope in a roadway. This makes a HUGE difference in how the car handles when going through intersections - regardless if keeping straight or making a high-speed turn.
    There will be many race courses in this map - some dedicated asphalt and dirt tracks both oval and European road-course style ones, with many twisting turns and some with a few opportunities for jumps. There is already one dirt track in the map, with at-least 5 more planned. Destruction derby arenas will be featured in more than one location, also. Not all will be a boring box, so as to give varied types of vehicles a native habitat for crashing - as if this game wasn't enough of that already.

    If I missed any other questions such as ones on the previous page that were important, you know who to scream at, here.
    --Cheers!
     
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  13. the pigeon guy

    the pigeon guy
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    how big is exactly this map? ?x?
    --- Post updated ---
    ps: it took 10 minutes to my computer to load Roane country.
    --- Post updated ---
    and guys the value and scale mod is nice
     
  14. Delta747Fan

    Delta747Fan
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    The amount of work you are putting into this mod, is awesome! When the next update releases, it's going to look amazing! I'm glad I have a gaming laptop to be able to run maps like this.
     
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  15. Honest Nick

    Honest Nick
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    I don't understand these big housing project buildings.
    screenshot_2020-03-18_18-26-49.jpg screenshot_2020-03-18_18-59-05.jpg
    They're typical for the east coast locations (New York, Philadelphia, Boston, etc.) but not for Californian city.
    Housing projects in California is mostly small buildings with 2-3 storeys, like that:
    Ramona_Gardens_Boyle_Heights_Los_Angeles_California_1.jpg 7798-80119211297112108.jpg

    Would be cool if some of these not-suitable buildings will be replaced in future versions.
     
  16. bob.blunderton

    bob.blunderton
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    Agree with you on some of those, but while there is dense city areas, there will also be many like you mention - I just haven't got to that part of town just yet. There will be plenty. Some buildings may be removed, moved, updated to look better, etc, it depends how development goes (much depends on the game engine, obviously still a work in progress just like this city, and how much FPS buffer I have in certain sections of the city VS what detail I can allocate / what I can put in an area yet before it bogs the rendering back-end down too much). Some big buildings are there to stay, but again some are just temporary so it doesn't look so vacant. I've got much better stuff in the works.
    Keep in mind that also, it is not just 'A California City' but there will be themes from all over the USA blended into this city - hopefully somewhat seamlessly. There's some parts that look a bit like downtown Miami, some parts where the homes look like the north-east USA areas, some parts that look a little like California cities do, and a bit that is quite run-down with some boarded up buildings that look like the many rust-belt cities after the jobs all left (NAFTA agreement was to blame). Certain rust-belt cities like Detroit Mi and Gary Indiana come to mind, among others.
    The reason this is not modeled after just one city, is that it gives a bigger amount of possible things that can go into the map, and leaves a lot of design decisions open as to how things can be done, giving much more creative freedom and hopefully a better end-product to boot.
    If there's something amazing that you really want in the map, but cannot seem to find of in another game (or want something like this-or-that in this map), DO let me know and I'll try to make time and space to put that into the map if possible. If not, maybe I can come pretty close to what you'd like - though it does not hurt to ask. Provided it keeps the immersion of the city and the general game-feel, I probably won't turn you down or dismiss the idea. This is a map supported by the people, for the people, so of-course everyone has a say in the end.
    Those are good reference pictures though, and I thank you for them, will definitely use them for reference material and hope I can whip up something close.
    *The tall, boarded up plus-shaped buildings are the Frederick or Frank Douglas towers (IIRC, it's one of those). These in the real-world are currently demolished but they were well-known years ago before the wrecking ball got to them. The section they are in is an area that is more like Detroit/Chicago than California.
    The large white building is a condominium which is common to many coastal or highly-built-up cities in the USA.


    This is the next skyscraper, it's almost done, I am just mostly matching UV's up to speed up rendering, then I have to do the LOD's and Collision for it and script in the new textures (for the ceiling inside). Speaking of which, when driving by, you will be able to see the lights in the ceiling shining through the windows. It'll be on the corner, so you'll be able to notice it as you drive by, and as such it should provide a little extra depth/immersion. It may get a parking garage under it, but I will be building modular sections of underground parking structures (will purchase if a good deal, or will use sections from the underground parking area from the police station / courthouse) so I can put these in many more sections. While it won't be the world's best-looking parking garage, or the most fancy one you ever saw, I will make sure it's immersive enough that you'll enjoy going in there.
    Not sure on the ETA for modular underground parking area, but if it does not make the next update, it will make the following one. Doing the best I can to make sure that it can be easily lined up with the grid lines when using 'snap to grid' in the editor, for those who don't want to take as long as real-life construction crew do to build yourself a road. It's supposed to be easier with this!
    I've spent the last 10 days or so mass-building roadways, placing 100's of curb sections, building roads (most have cross-slope for realism, but a few might not have as much as others).
    I would like to get some industry in to the map shortly after these skyscraper, near where I've built roads, so it doesn't look so badly empty.
    Shortly I will start work on the modular port pieces. The ones I currently have are temporary, and I've already purchased a new texture to use for the wall portion of the port concrete chunk that faces the water. I must complete most/all of the work I have in the current flow, before I start doing port-objects first, as I am already exceeding VRAM (as I've been for two years!!!) with my current work apps open and the game isn't even open at the moment. Hopefully the GPU market gets a little better, and things get a lot more reasonable price-wise, as not only will I not pay a penny over MSRP, I don't even want it for MSRP. They can dynamite them for the prices they want and I won't be upset in the slightest.
     

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  17. bob.blunderton

    bob.blunderton
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    Got the main tower mostly textured (still have to do the roof, and the textures on the window muttons/mullions e.g. dividers, may leave them flat-shaded a dark color).
    Have to do the lower (tan) portion of the tower, that shouldn't take TOO long. It'll be worth it when you can see the lights in the ceilings of the many floors as you drive by below, and adds a lot of depth.
    There might be a little more contrast on the tower colors in-game if I can help it.

    I keep hitting this stupid GPU VRAM error, and I've got nothing else open except the modeler, web browser, and sometimes a simple 2D game like Rimworld etc. Usually I can managed to get it saved despite the box constantly coming up, but sometimes it doesn't go away and keeps popping right back up. Time to update the modeling computer soon, and I'm not thrilled about it.
    Going to try to cull some of the textures from the image sources (what I feed the modeling software for use on models), and see if it helps, but if it doesn't, I will put more complicated models on the back burner for now until I procure a better card.
     

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  18. Average Person

    Average Person
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    I'm not sure how maya handles this but you may be able to get around the vram limit by just manually lowering the resolution of the textures you use for editing. I know that anything 4K and up can really eat away at memory. I don't really see it in the screenshots but if you're using the full texture set diffuse, normals, detail, etc. for your materials in maya you can also just cut that back to only the Color/Diffuse texture.
     
  19. Madkirk74

    Madkirk74
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    I subscribed to it and it wont show up. I dont have the other map.
     
  20. bob.blunderton

    bob.blunderton
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    Yes I did this earlier (before I saw your message), and it helped a little; but I will hit it again in short order. It did buy a little time though after I booted out all the normal/specular/emitter textures, and cut a number of 4k textures down to 512x512 for now - a bit drastic but it'll do fine. That doesn't change the game textures in-game, just in the modeler. This lowered the texture weight by 1.5gb ~ 1.75gb. OUCH.
    Splitting up the scene into manageable chunks also takes A LOT less VRAM (never-mind it uses less textures then).
    Thank-you for the suggestion, anything helps as always.


    If you have signed up to the Patreon, there's a version or two of the map that's newer than the public version by 3 months or so, and there will be a new one hopefully by the end of this month or just after, provided I don't get mired in issues over here. If it's longer it might be up to 10 days past that - I will keep people posted. It depends how quick my next batch of models goes.
    Most of the holdup was that I fast-tracked the 11-foot-8 bridge, which took weeks to model and finesse, and also due to the graphics format change, I ended up rooting through the map and weeding out many old stock-game-assets from older versions of ECA, JRI, GRIDMAP, small island, WCA, etc before replacing them with better ones, and even updating a lot of texture indices due to this.
    It's like map-open-heart-surgery, for lack of better explanation. It WILL be worth the wait, that's a promise. As always I appreciate everyone's patience for the best update yet on this map.
    If you are on the patreon for the map as a supporter, there should be a mega link in the posts on there.
    After the next update, monthly updates shall resume as-normal ESPECIALLY as I don't have as many huge hurdles to simultaneously bound across now that most of the CC-NC (non-commercial) license hold-ups on some models / textures are out of the way (it's been mentioned before).
    Sometimes it sucks working on something alone, I wish I had 8 arms/legs too, or just 10x more time, but I am doing the best I know how to do over here - after-all - it is a whole city/county the size of GTAV.


    OK so I couldn't resist THIS one! See the name on the side of the building, heehee.
    The building is 90% done, draw-calls for the diffuse textures should be under 40~55 draw calls total. Just have to do LOD's, Collision, and throw an elevator house/shaft in it & some front/back doors also. I will add the 'furniture' graphics (like the ones in windows of the updated downtown ECA) for the inside of this building at a later date as I don't have decent ones right this second nor time to make them.
     

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